Addicted to Work? The Psychology Behind Work Addiction, Part 2 — Alina Meyer-Riad

Welcome back to Share, Inspire and Explore podcast. This is part two of my two-part conversation with Alina Meyer-Riad on the psychology behind work addiction. If you're joining here first, I recommend going back to part one, because that is where Alina and I lay the foundation for this conversation. In part one, we explored what work addiction is, why it can be difficult to spot, how it differs from simply working hard and how validation, self-worth and unhealthy work patterns can keep people stuck. In the second part, we go deeper into the psychology behind work addiction. We explore where these patterns can come from, including perfectionism, people-pleasing and the fear of failure. We also talk about what recovery can look like

and why reaching out for support matters, and practical ways to begin creating healthier boundaries around work. So whether you're continuing from part one or joining us fresh here, let's get into part two.

So before we discuss the psychology behind it, just a reminder for our listeners, we're speaking generally here. Everyone's journey with stress, trauma or addiction is unique. Please reach out to a licensed professional for guidance that fits your context.

So Alina, what's happening psychologically when someone is addicted to work? So what we just said is that a lot of people who are addicted to work, or maybe are addicted to work, they feel that they are just important when they're working. So it's kind of the sentence in the head that they don't feel well and they don't feel lovable when they're not working. And this is a very hard sentence because when you have a sentence, I'm just good or I'm just lovable when I'm working, you can't stop because this is the only way how to get loved from maybe yourself or someone else. And the psychological thing behind it is maybe you learn it already from

your childhood. Maybe you learned already. Maybe your mom or your dad were like hard working people and they showed you loved while giving you money or giving you like things to buy or showing you you're just lovable when you work hard. And this could be a problem behind it. And this could also be a problem when you try to work less. This sentence will like tell you no, you're not worth it working less. You need to work to be lovable again. And you see like it's a circle circulation which is going down kind of and yeah, that could be something behind it. So, uh, you need to, you try to understand how it comes to this

point. And this could be a childhood thing. This could be your peer group while you're in. Um, this could be, I don't know, Germans work hard. So it could be a thing like where you, where you grow up. And this is something we need to think about it. So it's not just one thing. It, it could be like a lot behind it, but one thing could be your biological makeup. Um, it could be something you learn from your parents, from your peers and how you like a, like a child, like how you grew up. Yeah. And what is your, what is your negative sentence kind of, um, and your emotional, um, yeah, emotional regulation system,

like how you handle things kind of. And is it, is it common to see traits like perfectionism, people pleasing, or this fear of failure in work addicted individuals? Yeah, this is a good thing. Actually, yes. And no, because also there could be like many different, many different ways, how and why people are like people using work to manage something else, maybe. So kind of, it's always not always, but yeah, maybe it's always running away from something kind of, maybe running away from your life, maybe running away from that sentence we just talked about. And, this is very important to think about what you're running away from. And maybe you're running away from the sentence, you're doing something bad and you can't like handle it why someone is saying it.

So you try perfection because perfection is kind of, it's perfection. That's what the word is saying. But I think we all know that there is no perfection and there will always be a point where you can't like go any further. And this is maybe the problem. Maybe you're a people pleaser, maybe you're a perfectionist, but the problem with all of those things is that you kind of running away from yourself.

And maybe you're living a life which is not yours, which is just a sentence you learned. And yeah, there could be something behind it, like to be perfect or to be a people pleaser. But some, like, I think it's to be perfect is like the main thing. Try to be. I guess maybe those strategies worked when you were younger, but are not serving you so well. And that's what I tried to say. The sinner critic. Yeah, I can speak from experience. Yeah, you can't handle critic. And that's the thing. The people are very, I don't know if the word is right, but it's like critic, shy, shy of critical sentence. And this is like what you see in people

pleasing is what you see in perfection. This is what's behind, kind of. You can't fail. It's not like in your own little world. It's not happening that you will fail because maybe when you failed in your family, like there was not a good thing. That's true. You can't fail, you know? And this is what is behind people pleasing and also perfectionism that

that the people never learn to fail, that it's okay to fail. And this is what I try to learn. I have a client at the moment, he is having the same problem. And we try to learn how to fail. And it's so hard for him because he never learned how to fail. And now he feels it's okay and he will not die from failing. And yeah. That's how we learn, actually. Learn from your mistakes. Yeah, yeah, kind of. Yeah, great. So Alina, if we move on to recovery, you know, once someone realizes they're trapped in this cycle, what's the first step towards change that they can take? So it's always a good thing to get help or maybe just to talk with a friend, because it's very

important not to talk with yourself the whole time. And because we already talked about the sentence, like in those people, which is negative. So it needs to go out. We need to do the opposite of how we feel like getting help. And this is the hardest step, I guess, because when we just talked about

there's a person who can't fail, it's like very hard step to tell someone that he or she even fails. So I just want to tell like everyone who is in this circulation is it's very, very, very okay, not to be okay. And it's very important to understand that you will never like you, you're not dying from emotions. And it's funny how when people telling someone the first time that they having problems with something maybe would work sometimes, or often it's like someone is telling you, oh, I know that problem. I have the same. And this is what is happening when you, yeah, when you get help somewhere,

you will be be seen. And this is important that you show up, that you show up anywhere where you feel safe. This is important. Don't show up somewhere where you don't feel safe. This is not a good thing. So when you have a friend, maybe, or maybe your parents, you don't know if they are like understanding or not, or maybe toxic, I don't know, go somewhere else. Yeah. I think this is very important that the first step should be positive. So you find people with similar challenges, so to say. Yeah. And then you can relate. Yeah. This could be a start or maybe a professional, like maybe you're doing more. Maybe you're asking a professional counselor. Maybe you're asking your friends. Maybe you just start somewhere,

or maybe you're hearing a podcast while people talking about it, and you see your own story in it. But this can help too, that you don't feel alone in the end. And I think this is the point that we humans can change when we understand that we are not alone. Totally true. So what does resilience mean in the context of recovering from work addiction, Elena? Yeah, I know resilience is a very used word, but still it's important. And that's why I'm still using it while talking about addiction. Because I feel a person who is resilient more than another can get help easier, kind of. And because we know that people who are more resilient are more self-reflected too. And see if you're self-reflected,

you can get help easier than someone who's like running away the whole time and not seeing his or her problem coming, or even being there. So yeah, waiting for someone who is like helping you. But you can learn resilience. So this is a good, good news. You can learn it and you can learn it while being, um, yeah, more while we're talking about work addiction, being slower of being like in the moment and not in the future and not in the past and not somewhere else. Try to be more in the moment and try to ask yourself more often how you really feel and what you really need. And maybe you can have like your phone, which is

like telling you every hour how you feel and do you maybe need something to drink or something to eat to get better? Or maybe do you need like a break? And you can learn those kinds of things. Being more resilient means taking care of yourself. And also resilience is a word which normally means that you can get like maybe you're coming from a big problem and you handle it and you're getting well after it, kind of. So it's not like that you're in this problem feeling good. That's not what resilience is about. It's about being like really maybe on the ground and standing up again. And this is resilience. And this is when we talk about

addiction. It's a story of an addicted person who is getting well after it and who's like trying to change his or her life and being self-reflected. And this is, yeah, a story of resilience. So what I'm getting is it's the ability to bounce back, pick yourself off the ground because life will deal you some cards you don't want to be dealt with. Interesting. Yeah, yeah. This is resilience. It's coming from, I think, chemistry. It means like a thing which is, yeah, you press it together and it has the, it can bounce like back. And this is like when we talk about resilience people, it doesn't mean that they feel good while they are like on the ground. It just

means they have the possibility or they, they have the strength to stand up again and again and again and again. And it gets better and better and better while like being self-reflected. So maybe you learn, you don't learn it from the last moment, but maybe you learn it next time and getting resilient and resilient and like maybe in the end of your life to think, okay, I managed it. That's great. So it's, it ties in with the fear of failure. So allowing yourself to fail and the bounce back, this is the, this is resilience building. It is. Through self-reflection. Are there any other, let's say small practices someone can begin to shift out of this work addiction you can share with our

listeners? Yeah. Which is like what is really important to, I know it's hard when you're already work addicted, but it's very important to get breaks, to set breaks like every day. And because like our brain is not like, don't want to work like 10 hours, it's not very clever, to be very honest. It's not clever. It's not productive. It's, it's, um, yeah, it's a good thing to, to do breaks, to maybe go out and do a kind of a reset. Maybe you're doing a little nap because also your brain can like slow down or maybe just close your eyes. That's good enough maybe for a moment, but it's not a good thing to run the whole

day. And ask yourself in the end of the day, what did I do? If you, if you see yourself every evening sitting there asking yourself, what did I do today? It was everything automatically. This could be a sign that you need more breaks and you need maybe water. And this is what I do. Um, I try not to have a water bottle here in my, um, office because I want to stand up, go somewhere, taking water, go back to, yeah, have my little break kind of. Yeah. You get some steps. There's compounding habits. Yes. And sports is very good as well. Doing sports. Also good. Maybe music, if you like music, which is also good for your brain. I guess many of our listeners are working in, let's say,

corporate environments. And so I think that it's not just under the individual. It's up to the organizations to create these safe spaces to, to allow for rest and these back-to-back meetings. Yeah. It's clear how that. Yes. And we only have maybe three or four hours as I've read, focus. Our brains can only handle like three hours focus. That's it. The working day is eight and a half, eight and upwards. Right. Um, and that's from historical women. Factory workers were working the long shifts. So I think they're, I think we've had HR experts on here and talked about new ways of working. So yeah, I hope that change can happen to allow, so you don't feel this guilt or shame by

taking breaks. And this is the, this is the hardest part, right? You can tell someone to take breaks, but yeah, if you're the only one in the office taking the breaks, then that doesn't feel great. So it needs to be maybe a policy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It needs to, it needs to have something from like upper level of course. And if you can, because I'm doing this thing with my clients, even if they're not having like support from the office, it's still important to try like to set your own boundaries. Even if it maybe means that the group is not liking you any longer, but in the end it's important that you like yourself and it's your

life because you're like coming to the world alone, you're going alone. So it's very important to think like what you really want from your life and from that day. And if it means that you will take a break, go for it.

So Alina, many listeners might feel scared or ashamed hearing this today. What would you say to someone who feels seen but stuck in the situation? Yeah, this is a very important question. I just want to tell you that, like I already said, it's okay not to be okay. And when I think about my own story, I stuck in the same situation. I was working in rehabilitation. I was like running the whole time. And in the end, it was not worth it. So it's very important to understand that like every day counts. And it's okay to stand up and like kind of fight for your

for your boundaries and fight for your self-care and for your mental health, because that's the only thing we have. And yeah, just if it's possible in the first, in the first, on the first step, maybe it's okay to chat with the computer to ask, "Hey, is it okay?" This could be like a step before talking to an actual human. So maybe try this as well. There's also a GBT for addiction, which is which is now in Germany, such GBT, and it will like know a lot about addiction. So maybe you can chat with this as well or better with a friend. But the important thing is to reach out to someone. Yeah. The important thing is not to leave it in your body or in your brain, because this will not

really help. Because we talked about the negative sentences and they will stay when you try to handle it yourself the whole time. Because you maybe already tried it and it's not working. So maybe try something else. Super. Thank you. You're welcome. And just a reminder, if anything in this episode brings up difficult feelings, know that support is available. The show isn't therapy, but we hope it starts a conversation. You'll find resources and the helplines in the show notes.

Alina, thank you so much for sharing your deep insights on work addiction and resilience. Your clarity, compassion and practical guidance brought so much value to this conversation. I'll leave a link in the description where our listeners can reach out to you professionally. Thanks again for joining me. Thanks a lot for having me. It was a pleasure. And yeah, good time with you. Thanks a lot. Yeah, I'd love to have you back one day on the podcast, Alina, maybe to discuss addictive behaviors and coping mechanisms during program. Oh, yeah. Thank you. And to you, the listeners, I hope today has given you a better understanding of how to recognize harmful work patterns and build healthier, more sustainable ways of living and working.

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Thanks for being a part of this journey. And until next time, take care, keep exploring what's possible. I'm Chris Wilson, and that's where I'm at.